[rabidray]

i have a very strong chance at getting a super charged v6 motor out of a 98 riveara {buick} it was wrecked this morning about 2 hours ago.......

several q,s have crossed my mind .....what i have on hand parts wise is a 1978 scout ......t-19 wide ratio tranny d-20 t-case and a pair of d-44 axels with track-loc diffs, the only problem with these is they have 3.54 gears and i beleive that the carrier on these diffs will only accept up too a 4.00 ring gear............

also finding a bellhousing......

a fly wheel .......

and a clutch and prssure plate that will work with this combination of parts .....

being a v-tec sc v-6 .. t-19 tranny {ih scout}.......

just little things like motor rotation tranny rotation are bothering my dreams of a way over powered zuk.......

and then there is the wireing too be done that is another sore spot.......

but i do have a bare frame as a starting point......so if the motor and tranny can be mated together it will be easier to place all this stuff and lay it out with out being hamppered by the body getting in the way..........

any thoughts would be apprecited be brutaly honest i would exspect nothing less from this forum.......

 

[Rockrat]

If the diffs were 3:73 or higher you could get larger but at 3:54 the carrier will only except up to a 3:73.

 

[rabidray]

3.54,s

do you think i could get away with running 33x12.50 tyres with the stock 3.54 gears ......my first gear would be 6.3 to 1 so i could get it rolling without smokeing the clutch and be rolling 3-4 mph when i hit 2nd gear.........on the street....

in low range it would have a crawl ratio of 60 something to 1 so that would not be an issue right away.......

im not sure how much hp the v6 makes but i would bet its over 200 ponies so i think it would be a workable combo until i can get the money to regear the axels.........

 

[rotozuk]

You want honest.. Ok.

So you have easy access to these parts.. Great. But do they make sense to try and mate up? You might be better off selling off the Scout parts and getting something that will mate up to that engine. My guess is that you have the 3800 with the GM blower on it. Do some searching and see what the hell will mate up to that engine. You might check the Isuzu and Jeep sections as they both had a short spell of 60 degree V6 engines in the late 80s early 90s. As I recall, Team Purple runs a baby star bolted up to a Jeep automatic. I think the baby star has the same bolt pattern as the 3800... But I am no expert on this!!!!!!

Wiring can be a pain, but is not all that bad. And the GM stuff tends to be rather easy.

Measure that motor... and pay close attention to things like oil pan and exhuast. Both of these items can be a huge headache down the line.

If all works out, keep us posted.

-Wayne

 

[rotozuk]

Wow,

If you don't have the money to regear the axles.. You probably don't have the money to build up this vehicle either. Swaps get expensive unless you happen to have a machine shop or junkyard out back.

-Wayne

 

[rabidray]

i didnt say it

happen over night......

but i have many freinds and they do government work for me when needed.......i dont ask very often but evry time ihave asked in the past they have been more than willing to do what i need....

most of the time they are greatly amused with the projects that i undertake.......

outboarding springs on a bare frame and engine tranny placement should not be big deal..........now makeing the body fit could be a task........

as the car was wrecked this morning i havent had a chance too research anthing but yes i am not above finding a tranny too fit the engine ......if i can bolt it together i can make it work.....

 

[[email protected]]

3800 is a 90° V6 (231 Buick) and traces it's roots to the 225 used in Kaisers. Maybe some of that stuff will help. I don't know what all is new (40 years later) but FWD 3800's are differtent than old odd-fire 225's and 231's. Enjoy, MIKE

 

[BoOstedZooK]

FWD 3800 would be 60*

Don't know about manual trans but a 60* 700R4 will bolt up using 1/4" spacers between the flywheel and T/C. (Thanks TonyK for helping me with this info)


Whats the v-tec all about? Are you talking about 2 different engines?

 

[[email protected]]

FWD 3800 would be 60*

U sure?. I get them in the shop all of the time. 60° GM V6's are related to the Chevy 2.8 from the 80's (2.8,3.1,3.4 etc.) ((a knock-off of the German Ford)) (((still around as the 4.0 Exploder))) and the 3800 is a Buick engine with the oil pump in the timing cover. (196, 225 & 231 odd fire, 231/3.8/3800 even fire and the 4.1/252{siamese bore}). The Buick's are all 90°. I don't know if the later FWD 3800's have a different bell pattern (to match 60°'s ?), crank trigger etc. 60° V6's are naturally even fire and 90° have to use split rod throws to achieve an even firing order. The 3800 is not a bad motor, and you get an Eaton blower on them. MIKE
PS: ° is alt,0,1,7,6 in the "char map"

 

[scwafish]

My turn...I had an IH for years.

Don't worry about the carrier in the 44s because you don't want the trash-loc anyways BTDT, its damn near the same as open. Open 44 carriers are $50 NEW, throw in a luchbox and your done for a total of $250. People will say they suck blah blah but I ran a lockrite in the 44 in the front of my heavy ass IH on 36s for a long time.

The T-19 is the worst of yesterday. Durable and a sweet granny but a huge iron pig if there ever was one. I can't even imagine the tuneel carnage required to make it fit. Sell if to some Heep dude.

In fact I can't imagine back to all of that leaky, heavy clunky yankee junk period. Keep the 44's sell the rest to finance a pimp 16V and keep it light, simple, and dependable.

 

[rabidray]

i think its a vortec series engine

its a new series of egine that gm has been playing with the last few years .......

ot least there was a badge on the deck lid that said something to that effect.....

i havent kept up with the automotive scene for the last 20 or so years ......my zuk has reawakened the gearhead thats deep down inside my soul.......so ihave a lot of catching up too do.....

thanks for the run down on the engine mike that will help me out i am sure.......you have to know where youve been too know where you are going.......

i have also been told that the front wheel drive motors have a different bell bolt pattern......i dont know this too be a fact but i hope gm was not stupid enough to do this......

but it does look like i will be delving into american iron once again
so be it.......................

 

[Greg55_99]

The Buick 3800 V6 traces it's roots back to the 198 V6 and 3.8 RWD V6. The 3800 is a 90 degree engine but has the GM 60 degree bellhousing bolt pattern. So, any transmission that bolts to the 60* engines will work with he 3800. That includes:

Chevy 2.8/3.1/3.4 V6
Jeep/Dodge 2.5L L4
Isuzu 3.2/3.5 V6

Greg

 

[ManglerYJ]

I can answer the gearing question.... you will be fine with the 3.54 gears as long as you have some horses in the motor, which it sounds like you do. I turn 35" SX's with 3.07 gears and a 6.5:1 first gear in my SM465. It's not ideal, but it works. I also have a Tuned Port Chevy V8 helping out, though. I will be re-gearuing soon, but I've ran that way for 3 years.

Like others said, though.... if you are going that deep into a project, regearing shouldn't be a concern, it's just time and money.

Matt

 

[rabidray]

im in

have a freind name of foss hicks he runs moab acouple times a year.....so with contacts like his little group i should be able to aqiure the dana 44 stuff ......as for the tranny-t-case ill talk to a freind of mine at the local junk yard {way cheap parts } so im gonna give it a go and see what happens..........................

 

[junkyard joe]

not completely sure on this gm v-6 but would assume that the bolt pattern would be the usual 60 degree v-6, this has the same bolt pattern as the yj 4cyl except the starter is on the opposite side, so if you dont mind buying a bellhousign and then cutting and welding should work awsome

 

[BoOstedZooK]

The 3800 is a 90 degree engine but has the GM 60 degree bellhousing bolt pattern.

Yes. :idea: I knew it was not a traditional 60° engine, but had a 60° bolt pattern. Thats what causes the confusion. thanks

° -(thanks mike)

-Ryan