[Lil' Rich]

I would like to touch on the subject of window nets and mandating them for 2009. I would also like to add that when mounted, vechiles may not be alowed to drill the chassis for mounting hardware. This was an issue when Brian Errea broke his B-Pilar at a drilled hole where the window net would sit in.

Furthermore, I think window nets should have no more than 2 inches of opening available in the window and that they may not be zip tied to the chassis.

 

[DOUG38S]

I also agree. I think the nylon mesh nets offer good visabilty and the mounting sytems are way to easy to set up not to be used.

On another note maybe a rule about how far the seat car be mounted towards the side of vehicle should be in effect. I've seen buggies being built that are so tight that there is no other option for the drivers arm but to hang out the window. Maybe a minimum width chassis rule?

 

[Lil' Rich]

I also agree. I think the nylon mesh nets offer good visabilty and the mounting sytems are way to easy to set up not to be used.

On another note maybe a rule about how far the seat car be mounted towards the side of vehicle should be in effect. I've seen buggies being built that are so tight that there is no other option for the drivers arm but to hang out the window. Maybe a minimum width chassis rule?

We have minimum chassis rules for all classes but Unlimited. For the Stock and f-toy class, they must use stock type location and nobody has pushed it. Pro Mod there was an issue with older vehicles, all of which no longer run like Les Allen's or Chris May's, they have either been altered and retired. We also have a minimum roof width rule for the Pro Mod class so people are not getting caried away thre as well.

 

[desertoy]

After running window nets for that last 2 years, and seeing all of the "rig jobs" in the F-toy class. Here's what I would suggest;

1. Window net must span from rear of head rest, foreword atleast to the fully belted drivers wrist when holding the steering wheel and span complete opening from top to bottom.

2. Must be mounted inside the center line of the window opening using metal hardware without drilling chassis tubing.

3. Must be permanently mounted to roof bar and latched at mid bar ( this way, when you are upside down, the net will fall out of the way so you can get out).

4. Must be a certified window net, not a cargo net, not a fish net, A WINDOW NET.

 

[RedBullJeep]

John's got some good ideas and I agree that it's time to make the jump.

 

[Big Rich]

Look's like it just might be......

 

[TJMagoo]

Is this going to be a new rule of the mod-stock class? I'm already going to be in the garage all winter, need to know if I need to add this to the list of things to do.

 

[Lil' Rich]

Yes, Are there any last comments before we go public with this to the teams?

 

[RedBullJeep]

I think it's a given that we need to push further in addressing safety. far too many hands outside the cages on rollovers this year.

 

[Lil' Rich]

Vehicles must be equiped with window nets on the driver's side of the vehicle. Nets must be securely mounted with a positive locking mechanism, with no holes drilled into any portion of the chassis for mounting. Weld on brackets are permitted and the lever to release the window nets must be on the inside of the vehicle so that the driver can proporly reach the device for release. Window nets must be tight enough that they may not stretch more than four (4) inches out of the driver's compartment and may not have any further than two (2) inches of gap between the net and the roll cage. Nets may be any type of professional graded or racing rated window net as long as they meet the above stated requirements. "Velcro" type mounted nets are not permitted.

This rule mandates window nets, makes them tight enough to be worth while, large enough to where teams may not get hands out of the comparment, and keeps their cage from caving in by drilling the chassis like Brian Errea had earlier this year.

 

[RedBullJeep]

Rich, you need to clarify for Moon Buggies, RH drive, and also, the drilling the chassis should refer to "no drilling the A or B pillar" as those are main chassis components...other supporting tubes should not be an isse as they are not even required under the rules.

What else???

"properly" is misspelled in "so that the driver can proporly reach the device"

The "gap" note...what defines that? Consider a wing window and other things in the main opening and how will you work clarification?

Add in "no zip ties"

I'm sure there is more...anyone else???

 

[Big Rich]

A statement to clarify how much of the opening must be enclosed by the net...

In a stock rig the opening can be pretty dang big

 

[Lil' Rich]

I have clarified for rh drive, as "Driver's side", whatever side that may be.

I don't think teams should drill any part of the chassis for mounting of the window nets, regardless of whether those parts are required or not.

I'll change the word "Gap" to "Seperation" and have the following text like it already states after it "between the net and the roll cage." So the Rule will read: "Window nets must be tight enough that they may not stretch more than four (4) inches out of the driver's compartment and may not have any further than two (2) inches of seperation between the net and the roll cage."

Do you think the area between the A-pilar and the A-pilar support should be covered as well?

Agreed on no zip ties.

How do you want to handle the stock class openning? As well as the single seat window net terms?

 

[desertoy]

Because the window openings are so different from rig to rig, I would suggest the you add that the window net needs to span from the seat head rest at the rear to the drivers wrist with hands on the steering wheel at the front.

Also, instead of putting Left hand side, you should put "Driver Side". On single seat rigs it should be both sides unless the drivers hand cannot reach ouside the rig while belted in.

In the Stoock Mod class, if the whole door area is open, The window net should span vertically from the drivers belt line to the roof bar.

 

[RedBullJeep]

I have clarified for rh drive, as "Driver's side", whatever side that may be.

I don't think teams should drill any part of the chassis for mounting of the window nets, regardless of whether those parts are required or not.

I'll change the word "Gap" to "Seperation" and have the following text like it already states after it "between the net and the roll cage." So the Rule will read: "Window nets must be tight enough that they may not stretch more than four (4) inches out of the driver's compartment and may not have any further than two (2) inches of seperation between the net and the roll cage."

Do you think the area between the A-pilar and the A-pilar support should be covered as well?

Agreed on no zip ties.

How do you want to handle the stock class openning? As well as the single seat window net terms?

This needs some time and work...there are more factors but I don't have time to nail them down right now.

As for the single seaters, the one thing that stands out in my mind after all of these years is Shaffer, unconscious, in the middle of an endo, and one arm out each window and just begging to be lopped off between the rock and the rollbar tube.

Wording is getting closer, but there's more...let's keep this open for nailing it all down for a week or so before publishing the exact rules.

If we want to make an announcement that we will be creating a pretty strict ruling on window nets for 2009, that would be fine. At least let them know that we're working on it and that it'll be a real window net for real safety reasons, not just a lame rule that's easilly gotten around.

 

[Lil' Rich]

I personally feel that the entire main window area needs to be netted. Below is what I have gathered so far...

1. Safety nets are mandatory on all vehicles competiting and must cover the complete open area of the driver's side.

2. Window Nets should be tight, so that no occupant should push the net out more than 4 inches (4 inches is what was recommended from DJ Safety, Simpson, Impact, and Crow)

3. Window nets should cover the entire main window area. Moreover that if a limb can come out in any way, the area must be netted.

4. The seperation between the net and the cage may not be any greater than 2 inches at any point throughout the entirety of the design.

5. Nets must be secured by a positive locking mechanism and shall be installed so that the driver can release the netting and exit the vehicle unassisted regardless of vehicle position.

6. Netting must be installed on the inside of the roll cage bars so that it will not be damaged or come off the vehicle in the event of a roll-over or slide on the side.

7. The net border or edge and mounting materials must be made of materials that are as strong or stronger than the netting itself.

8. "Zip tie", plastic fastener, or "velcro" systems are not permitted. Acceptable methods of tying the nets into the vehicle include: Hose Clamps, metal hooks, and steel rods.

9. Arm restraints will be allowed but must be in addition to the required safety nets.

10. Vehicles with "Wing Areas" (the area between the A pilar and A pilar support bar) may keep the area open without netting unless reachable for the occupant while harnessed inside of vehicle.

11. Unlimited Class Single Seat Vehicles should have nets in both window areas on the driver's side and opposite where drivers can reach out both sides.

12. Modified Stock vehicles with no doorbar or lowered doorbar must have netting surrounding the entire openning from bottom of the seat up.

 

[TJMagoo]

So if you look at my door opening, you're saying it all needs to be covered?

 

[Lil' Rich]

like this... Or you can add a hingable door bar and only go down to that...

 

[desertoy]

10. Vehicles with "Wing Areas" (the area between the A pilar and A pilar support bar) may keep the area open without netting unless reachable for the occupant while harnessed inside of vehicle.

I think you need to expand on this Rich. What does reachable mean. Obviously I don't want to go out and buy new window nets after running them for the past 2 years, but I will if I have to.

Right now my window net ends in line with my steering wheel. Per your rules, I just need to add a wind wing bar? That doesn't make much sense. forcing me to add a wind wing bar to be compliant with the window net rule.

Just playing devil's advocate. What say you?

 

[Lil' Rich]

Pretty much, if you want to do that instead of buying a new window net, then fine by me. I think that all tube chassis vehicles should have an A-Pilar Support bar anyway.