New welder - what to buy??

DozerDan · Apr 2, 2020

So I am considering getting (another) welder.

Currently have

Hobart Handler 140

Hobart Beta Mig 251

and a bunch of tombstone stick units.

Want to be able to weld Aluminum. Neither of my Mig units can take a spool gun, and non of my stick units are DC.

Looks like I done to getting a Tig/stick/spool unit Or a new mig and adding a spool gun.

My 251 works decent, has some hiccups from time to time, so part of me likes the idea of a Miller 252 with spool gun. But I also like the idea of being able to Tig if I wanted.

Seems like Ideally I want one of each. But that is not in budget.

What say ye...

total newb · Apr 2, 2020

None of my stick units are dc?

You want to weld alum. Alum wants ac.

How do you want to weld? Ac tombstone with a basic tig kit will get you a 60hz ac bare basic tig.

Idk that it would take to spool of the tombstone.

OscarJr · Apr 2, 2020

My HTP Pro Pulse 220MTS can weld aluminum without a spool gun. It uses a 8ft Binzel style gun (MB26KD style) with a carbon graphite liner for Al, and can accept up to 12" spools (16-20lbs for alum, up to 44lbs for steel). Since it uses pulsed-spray programs, it can weld aluminum down to 0.032" and up to 6mm (approx ¼"). To switch to steel, you just swap the gun out to one with a standard steel liner, swap the spool, change the synergic program, and change the shielding gas. You can also Stick/DC TIG (lift-arc) up to 200A as well.

Here is a pic of it's capabilities on steel, comparing short-circuit vs pulsed-spray synergic programs.

[Memphis] · Apr 3, 2020

I have been eyeing up the Miller 211 for my current build

I want dual voltage since I don't have 240v outside yet... it will do aluminum with a spool guy and it's reasonably portable because it's not transformer based, it's stupid light weight.

I just don't have the $1700 CAD right now...

yblow · Apr 3, 2020

I just purchased a new welder with the same interests. I was stuck between millermatic 255p, htp 220 and everlast 253dpi. I really wanted the htp pp 300.

DozerDan · Apr 3, 2020

yblow said:
I just purchased a new welder with the same interests. I was stuck between millermatic 255p, htp 220 and everlast 253dpi. I really wanted the htp pp 300.

But what did you go with?

DozerDan · Apr 3, 2020

total newb said:
None of my stick units are dc?

You want to weld alum. Alum wants ac.

How do you want to weld? Ac tombstone with a basic tig kit will get you a 60hz ac bare basic tig.

Idk that it would take to spool of the tombstone.

Um have I mispoken or missed something. I have always been told Stick welding AL is DC. I once tried some AC 'rods' and it was horrible.

No way to make an AC stick unit run a spool gun... What are you smoking, or what do I need to be smoking? :flipoff2:

Provience · Apr 3, 2020

stick welding aluminum is horrible :rasta: but not so horrible if you only don't do it all the time

do you have any interest in pickup up a poly liner and rollers for your current mig and an argon tank and using your current setup?

if you just want an excuse for a tig, have at it :smokin: what's your budget

Crisbee1 · Apr 3, 2020

I have had my 211 3 or 4 years, somewhere around 10 8lb rolls of .030 through it, Works as new and never had any issues. 50 amp 220 in shop and I have used it on a 30 amp 110 circuit with 100' of 12g extension cord. I did not get the spool gun.

wolfe_man · Apr 3, 2020

I run aluminum all the time in my mm175 without changing a thing besides the tank from c25 to straight argon. It birdnests occasionally when starting the wire down liner but runs it just fine. I do keep the whip from kinking or tight radiuses when running it though. I also run 1 size larger tip than the wire I am running. I.E. wire is .030 I run a .035 tip

DozerDan · Apr 3, 2020

Provience said:
stick welding aluminum is horrible :rasta: but not so horrible if you only don't do it all the time

do you have any interest in pickup up a poly liner and rollers for your current mig and an argon tank and using your current setup?

if you just want an excuse for a tig, have at it :smokin: what's your budget

I just recently realized that might be an option. If I can I would totally just set my current welder up that way.

yblow · Apr 3, 2020

But what did you go with?[/QUOTE]

I went with the 253dpi.

Grab a teflon liner with the shortest torch line you have, preferably 10' or less. 5356 is stiffer than 4043 might run smoother. Some advice if you dont have aluminum settings on your welder, start with a high wire speed or your weld your tips really easy.

[486] · Apr 3, 2020

you've got MIG pretty well covered, and AC stick covered for basic outdoors farm type portable usage
leaves TIG and DC stick unfulfilled

I'd look around for a miller 330a/bp or equivalent (mine's an airco, so it's orange but the same machine inside)
it's a 300a (well, it'll do 425 on the spec sheet) ac/dc constant current supply with HF start, tig solenoids and a pedal
they're available down around 500 bucks on occasion, you should have better luck on that being in the east

ETA: and best part: you can get the whole repair manual and theory of operation and the schematics and circuit diagrams from miller by email
they're pretty simple, they use a huge magnetic amplifier for current control which is WAY neat once you understand how it's doing what it does

[486] · Apr 3, 2020

DC aluminum MIG is... well
ever see those big globby welds with zero penetration all over older aluminum trailers? that's what you'll get unless you do a very meticulous job cleaning and preheating everything

the AC cleaning action, being able to footpedal the heat, and separating the arc/filler just makes a world of difference in aluminum

DozerDan · Apr 3, 2020

yblow said:
But what did you go with?

I went with the 253dpi.

Grab a teflon liner with the shortest torch line you have, preferably 10' or less. 5356 is stiffer than 4043 might run smoother. Some advice if you dont have aluminum settings on your welder, start with a high wire speed or your weld your tips really easy.[/QUOTE]

Current Mig is a cira 1997 (ish) Hobart, with a Miller M25 15' lead on it. Pretty sure that rules out that

DozerDan · Apr 3, 2020

[486] said:
DC aluminum MIG is... well
ever see those big globby welds with zero penetration all over older aluminum trailers? that's what you'll get unless you do a very meticulous job cleaning and preheating everything

the AC cleaning action, being able to footpedal the heat, and separating the arc/filler just makes a world of difference in aluminum

Yes AC tig/mig DC stick. That was what I always was told.

Provience · Apr 3, 2020

DozerDan said:
I just recently realized that might be an option. If I can I would totally just set my current welder up that way.

it's not bad, no reason you couldn't set up your larger mig to do it.

i guess you don't have to change out liners, the only time i've done it was at a place that had two torches all set up so it was easy to swap steel to aluminium.

it's supposed to help keep bird nesting down and a few feet is a long column to push the AL wire through, and it doesn't like doing it as much as the shorter spool gun.

but, if you are doing a bunch and can use wire of decent size, mig lays down material

edit: yes, because it is DC you don't get the cleaning action, so clean everything well

arse_sidewards · Apr 3, 2020

DozerDan said:
and non of my stick units are DC.

Get a fucking DC stick welder you caveman. :flipoff2:

Stick welding aluminum isn't that bad.

OscarJr · Apr 3, 2020

Provience said:
edit: yes, because it is DC you don't get the cleaning action, so clean everything well

You do get cleaning action on aluminum MIG because its 100% DCEP - the electric arc is always coming from the base metal to the wire electrode, so it is continually breaking up the oxide layer. The real tricky part is to make sure it is operating in spray-transfer, or a pulsed-spray transfer if the machine has that capability.

aczlan · Apr 3, 2020

[Memphis] said:
I have been eyeing up the Miller 211 for my current build

I want dual voltage since I don't have 240v outside yet... it will do aluminum with a spool guy and it's reasonably portable because it's not transformer based, it's stupid light weight.

I just don't have the $1700 CAD right now...

Neighbor has one and likes it.

arse_sidewards said:
Get a fucking DC stick welder you caveman. :flipoff2:
Stick welding aluminum isn't that bad.

I have a Everlast PowerArc 200STI (200 amp DC stick inverter, 120/240V, can also do lift start TIG).
It replaced a 225 amp Lincoln AC tombstone and has been great.

Aaron Z

New welder - what to buy??

DozerDan

total newb

OscarJr

[Memphis]

yblow

DozerDan

DozerDan

Provience

Crisbee1

wolfe_man

DozerDan

yblow

[486]

[486]

DozerDan

DozerDan

Provience

arse_sidewards

OscarJr

aczlan

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